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Invesco Water Resources ETF T.PHO


Primary Symbol: PHO

The investment seeks to track the investment results (before fees and expenses) of the NASDAQ OMX US Water IndexSM (the underlying index). The fund generally will invest at least 90% of its total assets in the securities that comprise the underlying index. The underlying index seeks to track the performance of companies that create products designed to conserve and purify water for homes, businesses and industries. The underlying index may include common stocks, ordinary shares, American depositary receipts (ADRs), shares of beneficial interest and tracking stocks. The fund is non-diversified.


NDAQ:PHO - Post by User

Bullboard Posts
Comment by poneon Jun 06, 2015 6:19pm
122 Views
Post# 23804212

RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:R&D Spin-off Answer

RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:R&D Spin-off Answer
billy4325 wrote:
By the $1.1 mil, I assume you mean the "Products & services" and "Engineering & R&D" (please correct me if I'm wrong).  These charges are revenue for the Photon R&D and expenses to PHO.  The R&D tax credits are earned on the R&D expenses in Photon R&D.  I don't have the Photon R&D financial statements but by looking at the 2014, PHO financials, Photon R&D had payroll expenses of at least $1,330,306.  Add in the proxy portion of 55% which is to cover labour overhead (1,330,306 x 1.55) and that's about $2.06 mil of expenditures eligible for SR&ED at a minimum (they're going to have materials expense and there could possibly be payroll which doesn't go through PHO, but is paid directly by Photon R&D - I don't have that info).  
 
On the SR&ED expenses, currently they would be getting at least an extra 20% federally (35% CCPC high rate vs the current 15% rate which would be earned in PHO).  Plus instead of taking the 15% base rate as a non-refundable tax credit which they can't use until a future year, they get it back when filing the year's tax return since the entire 35% is refundable.  This doesn't include any potential provincial SR&ED benefits.
 
The funds from the royalty fee aren't just profit for Photon R&D, they're used to cover expenses of Photon R&D.
 
Photon R&D has expenses just from charges from PHO of:
 
Charges to:                                                                                                2014       2013
Revenue from sales of products and services to Photon R&D $    125,929 $ 267,970
Payroll reimbursement re: Photon Control R&D Ltd.                     1,330,306 1,448,432
Recovery of premises and related expenses                                     398,500    299,644
 
Plus they're going to have other operating expenses which aren't charged through PHO.
 
Yes, I'm not sure if there is as much benefit now as there was before.  There definately are still some SR&ED tax credit benefits.  I'm not sure of the implications of putting the IP in a separate company, whether there is much benefit or not from a business operations/strategy perspective.  Either way, it was done back in 2008 and they can't undo it, even if they wanted to.
 


Of course they could undo it.   It might require buying the subsidiary.   But at very least can't they add transparency to this whole scheme?   How about making a warrant that no related party benefits from this financially through a profit in Photon R&D?   How about a warrant that Photon R&D does not receive additional financing for its activities not shown on the Photon public financials?

The two ways that something like this could be misused:

1) Some of the R&D expense for Photon R&D gets funded by outside related parties with a strong equity interest in Photon.   That has the effect of boosting earnings and cash flow for Photon, which over time the market will reward with a higher stock price.

2) Some of the R&D "royalty" becomes a dividend inside of Photon R&D to a related party who set up the R&D company, thus taking substantial percentages of earnings and moving them to a related party.   That would have the effect of hurting Photon's earnings.

I'm not saying they are doing either of those things.  I am saying that people look at such structures and ask the question "are they doing those things"?    Why not just give us some transparency so we understand who profits and how, and make sure that we get a clear indication that insiders are not using this for private gain?
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