Bombardier Inc. T.BBD.A

RE:RE:RE:RE:Where we sit with LTD

[BBDB859]

This is the only simple way to explain it to you.

-By answering/responding to your questions and #'s under each question of each paragraph in yellow below.

BTW, you're arguing about #'s that u and I are in close agreement with. 

Jim99999 wrote: You said debt is $7.3B. You also said they have $3.4B on hand. $7.3B - $3.4B = $3.9B net debt. Those are your numbers, not mine.

Yes I said that they had $3.4B on hand, because that's what was in their hands at the posting time. As well, I've explained to you why? Like I said that, they may have paid out the balance due on some of that 22/23 debt fully by now. If so then maybe you know something I don't. They did the offerings, but not all Bondholders cash out at the requested time of the payout by Bombardier. The fact is that, that doesn't really matter. Our #'s are the same on debt payment, with either  your method or mine. With out exausting the point.

Your numbers on the debt are accurate, but you have made several mistakes in your cash on hand calculations. 

My debt #, is exactly what the debt is. Your cash on hand is off by $250M from what I can see in your calculations. Read below

We know that at the end of Q1, they had pro forma liquidity of $2.6B ($2B cash + ~$600M in Alstom shares). The $2B cash was made up of $1.4B reserves (down from $1.8B due to $400M cash burn) and $600M left from BT sale. I think we agree on this. 

Agreed, we're good here, as far as I can see.

They sold the Alstom shares for 506M Euro, and used 426M Euro to redeem the Euro bonds, leaving 80M Euro. Call that $90M and cash on hand is at $2.09B.

This is where we start to differ on how they used the money to pay what off, with the funds. Specifically, what they paid off already, and what is still outstanding. Because I think, you do your calculations differently than I do. But we both come up with the same # at the end. So we're fine here too.BTW. It was $119.3M US left over from the Euro Bond, and they used it, to pay off the $119.3 @ 7.35% in Dec.2026. Potatoe potato.

Since then, they have raised $1.46B ($1.2B + $0.26B) in two offerings.  All of that has been put toward debt. The June tender offer cost ~$825M, the remaining Dec 2021 bonds cost ~$64M, the remaining Mar 2022 bonds cost ~$96M, and $475M for partial redemption of the Oct 2022 bonds. Add those numbers up and you get $1.46B.

The only change I would make to the above paragraph is. That the money they got or raised for the Private Bond offering for the Bondholder Dispute was $250M more than what you've added above. You acounted for only the $260M that they got. So knowing that, folow me to the final paragraph



So cash on hand is about $2.1B right now. LTD is about $7.35B right now. Net debt is about $5.25B right now ($7.35B - $2.1B)

Here now, from your calculations above: If you add the $250M that you didn't include from the previous paragraph as I pointed out. It's not $2.1B on hand. Then, they should have $2.35B on hand.  So Finally $7.35B - $2.35 on hand = Net Debt of closer to $4.950B. Agreed?

I'm now done with this. Even if I'm off by $250M and not you.  If you want to argue over this small difference of $250M (plus or minus ) in Net Debt here? Sorry I'm just not interested in continuing it. You wanna discuss something else, then fine. But we just differ, in the process of intervals, of how the debt is paid off. It takes time for these re-payments to take place. I have a little diferent payment schedule than you do. 

Jim

BBDB859 wrote: Hey Jim.

You're at it again, are you?

Since you like coloring in yellow. I'll color your post in yellow as well. So maybe then, we'll start to understand eachother better.

The actual, exact LTD current debt, is $7.332B. I didn't know that wanted it  good, to three decimal points. But that was the exact amount as of the time of my post. It may have changed by now, I don't know, I haven't looked at it, since I've posted on it. Next time I'll post it to 3 decimal points 4 u.

Now as for the cash on hand. I know it's a little confusing as to why it is closer to $3.4. 

You say they have $2.1B cash. Yes they could get to the $2.1 point range at some point in the very near future. Because they'll use some of the $3.4B to pay off some existing debt with the new assumed debt for 2026, that they just took on in a new placement.

But right now as it exists it is closer to $3.4B. Unless you want me to go, and ask Bombardier to give me their bank book, so I can verify it for you. That's what they have in hand right now. 

Here is why? 

-They have $1.4B Cash from reserves. (remember the $0.400B cashburn).
-They had about $0.6B left over from the BT receipts too.
-They did a JBD Issue for $1.2B recently due in 2026. (which they still have the cash on hand to use towards buying the balance of the $0.514B left for 2022 & $0.533B left for 2023 remaining to discharge.
-Remember that they also took $ 0.510B, in an offering, and they'll settle with that Bond Holder's breach complaint for $0.250B slowly as well. But they'll still have $0.261B left over from that Private offering.

So total on hand right now is $1.4B + $0.6B + $0.261B + $1.2B=  $3.46B left in their hands right now.

So from above. $3.46B - ($.514B + $.533B) = $2.41B - the $.250B (for that bond holder when the settlement time comes) and VIOLA  (there it is) $2.16B left over.

Now they'll $2.16B left after they settle their affairs. 

Sorry I had to spell it out arrogantly, like that. But that is how the real story unfolds, and we're not that far apart.

So again from above.

In summation

You say LTD is $7.35B and I said $7.3B but it is exactly $7.332B

And then.

You say that in your estimation the cash on hand is $2.1 and I say, Yes it will get to $2.16 after they end up using the cash to pay a couple LTD's, that are still outstanding on the Junk Bonds. Ya, there are a couple of stragglers, so we keep their cash on hand for when their turn comes to be paid.

As for Net Debt by my calulation they should be closer to $4.956B where as you came came with $3.9B??? I guess you misread my post, or sometimes posts, get a little confusing, when posting, because I don't want to spell out every detail calculation here, because it takes too long.

But if you need exact numbers, to three decimal points in the future, then you could just private message me, and I'll be happy to show my calculations.



Cheers
                        

Jim99999 wrote: You need to check your numbers. If they have $7.3B debt and $3.4B on hand, that suggests a net debt of $3.9B. We can only wish.

By my calculation, LTD is currently ~$7.35B, cash on hand is ~$2.1B, and net debt of about $5.25B

Jim

**N.B. My calculations include the previously announced redemption of the Mar 2022 bonds(~92M) and the previously announced partial redemption of the Oct 2022 bonds($475M), both of which close on July 22.