Artis Real Estate Investment Pref Shs Series E T.AX.PR.E

Artis Reit - Snake/Gary/et al

[Mongoose1234]

I used to cringe at Snake/Gary's posts totally embarassing himself. Now, i just laugh. 
He clearly has no idea of reality and this guy is the textbook example of why unsophisticated retail investors should not manage their own money.
If he bought this stock on margin, he's an absolute fool.
If he put in more htan he can afford to lose, he's an absolute fool.
If he bought this expecting a sure thing, he's an absolute fool.

Gary, heres a couple quick pointers. Get a pen and write these downs.
REITS are not 100% correlated to the bond market or cap rates. Go do some reading. it depends on NOI (which has a bunch of driving factors), Cap Rates, Future Growth expections of rents and many other factors. They will not (and i'll repeat that for you as you likley need it) NOT BE correlated strongly with bond markets. 

There are huge frictional costs associated with a windown or even someone taking private has to factor in frictional losses. 
As you clearly are not involved in commercial real estate, if you were, you'd know that liquidty for physical assets is low, and trades are infrequent for office/land/industrial. It is really slowed / slowing down. Samir can't just sell this stuff, this isn't a liquid asset....you need to do some reading on how large commercial real estate transactions take place. 
I won't even ask you to read up on frictional costs, as you won't understand that.

Secondly, this isn't coming back to $10 anytime soon...
Rates will slowly drift down (i'm not even going to try to ask you to understand forward yield curves) but nothing is happening quickly.

People will head back to the malls, and the office, but it'll take years to recover.

You made a poor investment, you need to live with that. No one is going to bail you out.

And no, Samir isn't in the same boat as you. he's in a very different boat, you'll never really understand that.

i would strongly recommend you hiring a financial advisor and stop trying to trade yourself as (if you haven't already) caused yourself disastrous losses, you very likely will.

and please stop posting your useless commentary
you are just embarassing yourself

[thenewsnake]

Good afternoon moongoose, since you eloquently explained some concerns I've been having rather than resorting to name calling, I appreciate the notes.  However, what you are failing to recognize is Manji is in the same boat and thinks different than you.  He called the strategic review to deliver results.  If he couldn't pull out something magical, he is effectively putting

[Mongoose1234]

Gary, you are just not getting it.... Samir doesn't care how quickly this goes up, or frankly what you care about him. buy 1% of the outstanding shares then and take some shareholder action. Oh wait, you can't. As Artis buys up shares, he owns a larger and larger %, and that means, there is less and less shares he has to buy out at a premium. Why would he rush it and pay more than he has

[thenewsnake]

"A REIT is fundamentally made up illiquid assets"? Really.  With exception of office I've seen many transactions in the REIT space this year.   PMZ is even buying/acquiring secondary malls (2 this year and one last week) which is the most undesirable asset for pension funds and other investors, all going into a possible recession.   Artis has sold 300m+ so

[Mongoose1234]

Gary, the fact you think a REIT is liquid or has liquid assets pretty much confirms my thoughts. 1. Artis has about three and a half billion in assets, selling $300M is just scratching the bare hurdle for materiality. its not moving the needle 2. Pension funds don't buy malls in secondary locations really, you clearly haven't worked in that world they buy institutional quality assets 3.

[thenewsnake]

Selling 300m if you only listed 300m for sale is 100%.  If they lised 100% of their assets for sale, it would bea lot higher.  Now comes into question the writedown they need to take to move them.   You can sell anything if you write it down cheap enough, a 9% cap rate, etc.  Industrial will probably sell on mass thats 800m.  Retail and office will be choppy from what

[Mongoose1234]

Gary, liquidity can only be had in large amounts with a large write down. So yes, it doesn't make any sense for any of us (Samir, you, me) to have them blow this out to try to generate liqudity.  The industrial is not likely to sell en bloc. Winnipeg industrial likley sells, the US industrial likley sells, some of the scattered assets likely sell. I highly doubt you have looked asset

[thenewsnake]

Moongoose, if what   you truly said is true then by god Mr  Manji and sandpiper grossly mistimed their millions of buys atound $9-11 late 2022/2023 if they are going to wait around many years to break even!

[Mongoose1234]

He is patient and smart Take notes and he is playing hte long game (yes, longer than he wanted as he got caught in a rising rate environment and wasn't hedged) but he'll get a buyout of the remaining few shares at $8-9 for some assets worth $10-12 if they are held privately so, no, his payoff and yours are not the same - the fact you think youre in the same boat as him is worrisome

[Frankie10]

Well said. When you say frictional costs, are you including latent taxes? If so, this has been something that I have been thinking about for quite some time now. I would love to know the PV of latent taxes as a % of NAV for each REIT.

[Mongoose1234]

Hi Frankie, this part requires the most 'estimation'. But there are a couple issues with estimations and mostly Artis has a lot of US holdings. Cross boarder situations makes tax extremely complicated, this is why Artis has to do some special divided work at the year end to try and even out the taxation issues caused by US and Canadian taxes and being subject to them in each jurisdiction

[Frankie10]

Thank you very much for the response. I agree, the latent tax in ALL REITs is material/meaningful. That said, when you present value this liability for most REITs the liability becomes nominal considering the holding period for most assets, in most REITs is indefinite. Artis however, as you point out, is very different given the potential immidate liquidation of assets. Your $3 estimate seems fair

[DZtrader]

You're so puckin s tupid it hurts. Why not just listen and learn instead of thinking you know better. Where has it gotten you thus far?