RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:RE:Impact of CSeries on BombardierAgreed. BTW, I like the wording "Autopsy". Nice touch.
Now if they can only keep the "idiot Heir" away from BA we'll be in great shape. We should take his Bomber Credit Card away from him too.
Great to hear that you finally figured out the manipulator's tricks. As you know I've been holding this bag for a while now. But I'm finally seeing some progress. I couldn't stand being lied to by these imbeciles.
I think the EM/BD duo will clean the remaining mess up soon. So who knows? Maybe you'll even start stashing some shares for the long term.
Cheers
clubhouse19 wrote: 859
I think it's time to quit analysing the autopsy of the c series and consider only what may be ahead. Trying to prove who is right or wrong on the past is really a moot point and not worth the constant rehash.
As I mentioned before, personally I just trade this for now, in fact have made about 12 trades in the last 2 weeks riding this up and traded for pennies and all in the black and have timed it pretty well.. I have learnt to play this manipulated market on a very short term basis always attmpting to keep the volatility on my side.
The bomber , has been much less volatile but swings like today and yesterday of 4 pennies I try to take advantage of rather than holding for any length of time as we have seen, anything is possible with the bomber including the possibility of shorters getting back in.
BBDB859 wrote: Hey Club.
Honestly, I don't know what your point was, and I don't know how I proved it. I thought it had to do with cash calls. If your point was that this Oliver and Hardy team had no financial choice because they we're hemorrhaging then. We're talking the same thing.
The second and bigest part of my point is that this is that. Other companies also run into trouble financially like the Bomer. But the differance is, is that they don't drown in a cup of water like these two imbeciles did.
When the CSeries/V-Raptor pet became such a burden. First you cut it's head off.
All I know is, is I made what I considered, an important point about this management (PB/AB) group. They were the worse business people I have ever seen. So they lied and pilliged the rest of the company to continue the charade. They were the management team. They kept throwing good money after bad. Don't tell me that Japan's Mitsubishi, who has more cash on hand than Airbus and Boeing put together wouldn't be interested in the CSeries? Nor Hitachi for BT for that matter. China would have jumped over hurdles to get the CSeries. We've hashed this over for quite some time. Let's not bother.
The fact to the matter is, that these idiots (PB/AB) just jumped from the frying pan into the fire with Airbus, that to me is unforgivable. They were incompetent at their job.
The management of this company was lousy, and i'm glad we didn't go BK.
clubhouse19 wrote: You're just proving my point, there was no other decision to be made and BTW...who else would have made an offer other than someone that had a current stake in the business and had the balance sheet to take it on.
Quebec/IQ got what they wanted out of it and BBD got rid of the money eating elephant of the cseries no matter how pretty it was.
And BTW...what other elephant would have partnered with BBD considering the debt and the cash infusion that was needed.
Being way over leveraged as the bomber was means they had no negotiating power whatsoever.
BBDB859 wrote: Hey club.
It sounds like to me that you are refering to, is a particular cash call towards the end of the JV Partnership, between the Bomber and Airbus.
Let's face it. The JV made no sense to me from the begining. As you say that the Bomber didn't have the cash to pay for cash calls going forward because of CASHFLOW issues in BT and everywhere else in the company.
What I'm refering to is bad management. Failure to realize that you're in a V-Raptor situation with the CSeries as Aboulafia article was saying and that CSeries/V-Raptor was going to eat up all your cash.
The mistake that AB/PB management team made in this regard was thinking that they could get into bed with an ELEPHANT in Airbus and keep up the cash calls and money needed to advance the CSeries program. IQ, or the Quebec Gov't was smarter when Bomber went into the JV with Airbus. They said that they are not participating in any future cash calls in the JV, and therefore they would take, less percentage of the JV, but no more cash infusion in the JV in the form of cash calls. As far as I'm concerned the IQ management team was much smarter than Bombardier's management team in that JV partnership regard. IQ saw that Bombardier is kicking the can (heavy debt) down the street, and they stayed out of this, CSeries BHOLE, that not only was swallowing Bombardier's cash, and would have swallowed IQ's cashflow as well. They (Govt/IQ) knew Bombardier's cash flow problems better than Ab/PB. Can you imagine how unaware this duo was
clubhouse19 wrote: The cash call made by Airbus is what I was referring to. Cash call being made by the majority partner to keep the partnership going..Cash call was to be used If remember correctly, with the Alabama plant..correct me if I am wrong.
Not a carte Blanche as the moneys are put up by both partners to go forward with the plan as agreed upon.It so happens that the bomber did not attain the cashflow as hoped especially with their issues in the rail division.
Just goes to show that the bomber could not go it alone nor cud they get funded by any reasonable investor to do so .
BBDB859 wrote: Hey Club.
I'm not sure what it was in that statement of "cash calls" that you need clarification on, by what you're saying below. But here's what I meant.
When you give your JV partner 51% of the company. You're in essence giving them "CARD BLANCHE" to spend your money. If they want to invest in PP&E like they did in Alabama? The Bomber had no choice but to comply with their 49% share in cash calls. The cash call refers to the 51% control. These cash calls are what I call gifts to your partner, because they even had given them the option to buy the CSeries for FMV. Did we see what the appraised value of the final deal for the CSeries sale? Fair MV. I didn't. The point being that when you don't lose or give control on top of the 51% freebee. Then to boot you're participating in spending money in the direction your partner wants to take the program to. This cash participation (cash calls) were even as further gift to the stupudity was the intent of the comment. Especially when you give your JV partner the option to take you out.
clubhouse19 wrote: When you say in the form of cash calls...BBD could not afford that cash call so if you say they made that cash call ..that is incorrect as far as I know.
BBD did not have the time let alone the money to be able to keep the C series waiting for things to turn around as they were leveraged in too many directions the worse being the debt. BTW...nothing stays on hold or suspension at no cost as it all costs money which just adds to the debt and IMO got lucky getting rid of it prior to the pandemic. Every plane they did not buil;d for those orders acyually saved them money as they were losers as far as returns are concerned.
IMO they would have been belly up by now unless they had a huge cash input by the governments.